1. Give a plot summary. If someone has already given a plot summary and you're satisfied with it, use a different prompt. If you feel the plot summary/summaries provided so far aren't perfect, you may respond by respectfully offering an emendation.
2. Figure out the rhyme scheme. Off-rhymes (i.e. near-rhymes) count. If someone has already discovered a rhyme scheme and you're satisfied with it, use a different prompt. If you feel the rhyme scheme/s provided so far aren't perfect, you may respond by respectfully offering an emendation.
3. T or F: It's important to the speaker to try to tell the truth, to be accurate, about his experience. Quote an example in support of your reasoning.
4. Look up the meanings of these words, and then say something about what these words say about the way the speaker looks at life. If someone has already presented the meanings of the words satisfactorily, you can skip that part and go right on to saying what the words say about the way the speaker looks at life. Here are the words:
hectoring
sniggers
pyx
randy
5. Same as (4), with these words:
myrrh
silt
accoutered
frowsty
6. What is the speaker's attitude, overall, to churches?
7. Why do you suppose the speaker goes up behind the lectern in the front of the empty church, looks over a few Bible verses, and says the words "here endeth," as if he were a minister at a church service?
6. the speaker's attitude towards church is kind of negative; in line 18, 'reflect the place was not worth stopping for', line 34, 'but superstition, like belief, must die', in line 38, 'a purpose more obscure', in line 53, 'What this accoustered frowsty barn is wortgh'. he thinks the church turns to corrupt. However, he can't deny its value as well; in line 9 'in awkward reverance', in line 54, 'it pleases me to stand in silence here'. although he thinks the church lost its true religious meaning and all, because there are still many dead people, who sacrifice themselves for church and tried to keep its true meaning, lie round, he can't give up the hopes that church will rise again.
ReplyDelete7. as we know, the narrator criticizes that church changes in its religious meaning. however, it seems like no one is trying to straighten things out, even people who have to do and be at the head of reforming, such as minister. so, by acting like a minister of the church, and read 'here endeth', he points out what should ministers do for the church.
3.Prompt 3 is true. "I sign the book, donate an Irish sixpence, Reflect the place was not worth stopping for. Yet stop I did: in fact I often do, And always end much at a loss like this," The narrator does not lie about the fact that he feels stopping at the church was not worth it, yet he willingly admits he does this frequently. He is giving his honest opinion of the church.
ReplyDelete6. His overall attitude towards churches is that fewer people are attending church and that he wonders what will come of the building overtime. "When churches will fall completely out of use What we shall turn them into,..." "Shall we avoid them them as unlucky places?" Another attitude the speaker has towards churches is that only those with a hunger in themselves to be serious will be the only ones eventually attending church. "Since someone will forever be surprising A hunger in himself to be more serious, And gravitating with it to this ground," The overall feeling of the speaker is that church-going will eventually only be for a very few in the population and that churches will only be used for the formal occasions like marriage, funerals, and baptisms.
Katie Burch
Greg
ReplyDelete6. As Dain said, I believe the speaker's attitude towards churches is negative. Many passages throughout the poem imply this, such as the speaker's description of a church: "matting, seats, and stone." It seems that everything is described by the speaker in a dull tone, rather than one of an exciting nature. For instance, the speaker "pronounces "Here endeth" much more loudly then he means
to." Moreover, the passage, "But superstition, like belief, must die," obviously implies a negative connatation towards this certain churches religion.
2. Each stanza is composed of 7 lines. The rhyme scheme is A-AAB-C-BC. The last words of each of the second and seventh lines of each stanza don't rhyme with any of the last words of the stanzas.
1. The narrator arrives late at church, perhaps for the first time in a while, seeing the church remodeled and touched up. He reads, he gives to the offering and decide it's not a place he'd like to be. He poses: What if people stopped going to church? He talks of the strange, rather stereotypical things that happen at a church, ie holidays or traditions. He talks about how churches are forgotten, more gradually with each coming week and that they are losing purpose. At the end, the narrator realizes that a church, even though the building may be coming more obsolete, it's purpose stays the same as a haven for theology and philosophy.
ReplyDelete3. (F) It's not necessarily a matter of telling the truth, but being accurate in the story telling. The words the narrator uses completely determine how the reader sees his appreciation or lackthereof for the subject. He may take it seriously, or be sarcastic. This line, "...For Sunday, brownish now; some brass and stuff up at the holy end;", doesn't really exhibit the narrator's interest in church. First of all, the word "stuff" seems like he didn't really pay attention to whatever it was, (we'll never know), and "the holy end" isn't necessarily an appropriate description of a church. (Also, the narrator talks superstitiously of church traditions and the sort).
4.
ReplyDeletehectoring: talk to (someone) in a bullying way
sniggers: a smothered or half-supressed laugh
pyx: the container in which the consecrated bread of the Eucharist is kept
randy: attraction
"Hectoring large-scale verses," The fact that the speaker would read verses from the bible in "a bullying way" shows that he does not care/has no respect for the religion. It seems as if he is mocking it.
"The echoes snigger briefly". This continues my idea that the speaker is mocking the bible verses, because a snigger is something usually used when mocking something.
"Their parchment, plate and pyx in locked cases". The fact that the speaker knows what a pyx is either means that he is Catholic or has some weird interest in the religion even though he tries very hard to make it look like he doesn't like it.
"Some ruin-bibber, randy for antique". The speaker uses the word "randy" to show that the only reason someone may want to keep churches around later is because they are attracted to antique things.
3. I believe the speaker thinks it is important to tell the truth, because I felt as if he was confused as to how he felt about the church and he is trying to sort himself out by speaking his mind. In the first few stanzas he is mentioning the many things in a church which are a constant no matter where you go, and says that he is paying respect to the place. He then contradicts himself later when he mentions "Hectoring large-scale verses" (this is definitely not a sign of respect). Also as Katie said, he claims the church "was not worth stopping for." but then he claims that he thinks every church isn't worth stopping for but still he tells us he stops all the time anyways. I feel that throughout the poem he is under a constant internal struggle to figure out his moral beliefs and where he belongs. To do this he is stating all the honest truth so he can discover what he wants.
I agree with Dain.The speakers attitude toward churches seems very negative.He shows this cynical view by his pessimistic predctions that Churches WILL become useles, not 'if'. 'When churches fall ompletely out of use'. Another example of the poet's skptical opinion of churches is in the passage 'But superstition, like belief, must die'. This makes me think maybe he is a person whose belief has died and he is speaking from experience.Even if the speaker dislikes churches there is still evidence that he visits churches often 'Another church', and 'Yet stop I did; in fact I often do,'.
ReplyDelete4) Hectoring: to treat with insolence/Sniggers: to laugh in a half-suppressed, indecorous or disrespectful manner/ Pyx:the box or vessel in which the reserved Eucharist or Host is kept/ Randy:sexually aroused; lustful; lecherous
ReplyDeleteThese words make me believe that the speaker finds certain things about religion strange and weird so his opinion about religion is reflected by these words.
5) myrrh: an aromatic resinous exudation from certain plants of the genus Myrrhis, esp. M. odorata, a small spiny tree: used for incense, perfume, etc./ Silt: earthy matter, fine sand, or the like carried by moving or running water and deposited as a sediment/Accoutered:to equip or outfit, esp. with military clothes, equipment, etc./ Frowsty:musty; ill-smelling
Because the word Myrrh is used, bible references come into play, but other earthly words are used as well, showing that the speaker could relate parts of religion to nature.
3. It is true that the speaker finds it important to state the truth because his description of his actions does not leave us assuming that his descriptions are biased: "Move forward, run my hand around the front. From where I stand, the roof looks almost new-Cleaned, or restored? Someone would know; I don't." The speaker does not try to make a guess about the ceiling, he simply makes an observation.
ReplyDelete6. I don't think that the speaker's attitude towards churches is negative or positive, "Reflect the place was not worth stopping for. Yet stop I did: in fact I often do, And always end much at a loss like this," The speaker seems to not approve about religion in general, "But superstition, like belief, must die," and yet he is always entering into churches as if he wants to believe. I think that the speaker thinks that someday he will enter one and something will come over him and he finally will appreciate these churches.
#2
ReplyDeleteThere is not a structured rhyming scheme at the end of each line, but masculine rhyme, assonance and consonance are very prevalent. Also the third to last line and the last line of each stanza rhyme with the exception of stanza five and 6 that exhibit assonance in those lines (1. silence, reverence 2. door, for 3. cases, places 4. die, sky 5. whiff, representative 6. idea, here 7. ground, round.
Stanza 1: Shut and cut are masculine rhyme while the word stuff continues with a near-rhyme (or assonance.) Stuff and off are examples of consonance. On and organ are a weak example of consonance.
Stanza 2: Don't and meant use consonance just like pronounce and sixpence do. Meant and sixpence share assonance.
Stanza 3: Do and too are masculine rhyme and so are keep and sheep. Sheep and show share alliteration like consonance. This and use seem like they should be near rhyme, but when read this has a clear "sss" sounds where as use has a "zzz" sound.
Stanza 4: Come, some, and random are masculine rhyme. One follows that near-rhyme with assonance. Stone, one, and on are consonance. On and gone are masculine rhyme.
Stanza 5: Week, seek, and antique rhyme. Who and crew display masculine rhyme and were and myrrh do too. Whiff and were have alliteration like consonance.
Stanza 6: Silt and unspilt rhyme. Ground and found are masculine rhyme. Birth and built have alliteration like consonance. Birth and worth are very close to masculine rhyme, but are definitely examples of consonance.
Stanza 7: Is and destinies share consonance with the "zzz" sound in their endings. Is and in have assonance. Meet and obsolete rhyme.
#7
The speaker says the words "here endeth" behind the lectern as an expression of why he is so curious about these churches. He acknowledges that a church is place that demands some reverence in the last line of the first stanza. However, he quickly changes to wondering about a time when churches don't call forth that type of respect: "When churches fall completely out of use what we shall turn them into, if we shall keep a few cathedrals chronically on show, their parchment, plate and pyx in locked cases, and let the rest rent-free rain and sheep. Shall we avoid them as unlucky places?"
Therefore he speaks the words "here endeth." There is the idea that an age is ending and a new one is coming, an age where churches may become useless. It drives the speaker to continue visiting these churches even though he says they are places that in the end are "not worth stopping for."
The words "here endeth" are the only words we know that he speaks for sure in the churches he goes too and It makes them all that more important to the over all meaning of the poem.
6. I think the speaker's attitude towards churches is negative at first but it changes as the poem goes on. We can see this because the speaker wonders, "when churches fall completely out of use, what we shall turn them into, if we shall keep a few cathedrals..." but "yet stop I did: in fact I often do" meaning he goes "church going" often. If he didn't like churches, he wouldn't want to go, therefore he must have some positive thoughts on churches.
ReplyDelete3. It's true that the speaker wants to be honest because there's no reason to lie in church. In the first stanza, it says: "Once I am sure there's nothing going on..." The speaker makes sure that there's nothing to influence him/her and that there's nothing to cover up.
1) The speaker finds himself in a church. He observes the imagery of this place, and sets a tone of how he feels in this environment. It is later known that he often returns to churches, almost as if he is trying to fin something. And that is where I disagree with our fourth commenter ... well not disagree, I just feel there is more to it. Yes, the narrator is observing and realizing how important the church has been to man, philosophy etc, but I think the bigger picture is that he is trying how he fits into this very large world, filled with meaning, struggling to find some truth within it.
ReplyDelete7) I believe the speaker imitates a priest, standing as he would and speaking as he would, not to be silly, but I believe he is truly trying to find meaning in this place that means so much to so many. The words he speaks I believe are almost like his subconscious questions coming through... as if he were asking if the church is really the right way, if this really is where life ends?
3. True: "When churches fall completely out of use what we shall turn them into, if we shall keep a few cathedrals chronically on show,"
ReplyDelete6:The speakers attitude towards church is a sacred and unique place. Not everyone appreciates it but those who do, are serious and dedicated people.
-Katherine N
3. I think it is important for the speaker to be truthful about his experience in order for it to be accurate. “a shape less recognizable each week, a purpose more obscure. I wonder who will be the last, the very last, to seek this place for what it is.” He speaks his mind here and is honest with his opinion on the church. What he says cannot be accurate unless he is truthful in what he is saying.
ReplyDelete6. The speaker doesn’t seem to have a very positive overall view of church. He seems to not be able to find the point in it “and always end much at a loss like this, wondering what to look for; wandering, too, when churches fall completely out of use” the speaker doesn’t seem to be able to figure out what use one can get from church; what the significance is from all of it
3. The sentence is true. The topic of this poem is about church. The author is criticizing today’s church, and he’s talking about the meaning or purpose of going church, and how the church supposed to be. So, the topic of this poem is really heavy, and serious. Also, I think it is pretty hard to express in words. Because of that, to criticize the church, the author has to give us a more specific and accurate examples or descriptions of his experience. For instance, on line 28, it said “Or, after dark, will dubious women come To make their children touch a particular stone”, and on line 30, “Pick simples for a cancer, or on some”. These are the line about the superstitions that the author found in the church. On these sentences, he gave us details, such as “after dark”, and “dubious woman”. Actually these lines are accurate descriptions of his experience. So, I think it is really important the author to be accurate for readers to understand his criticism.
ReplyDelete6. The speaker’s attitude to the churches is very negative. I would say he is against to the churches. On the first line of this poem, he said “Once I am sure there’s nothing going on.” The author is saying that there is no meaning of going church. And on the line 21, “When churches fall completely out of use”. He is kind of predicting that the churches are going to fall completely out of use, and he’s also saying that it is falling now. The speaker is keep criticizing the churches.
Sinae Hwang
6)I could realize from the poem that the speaker is not a very religious person. He thinks that people believe in religion because they feel they need something bigger than themselves to believe in. At first, the speaker just thinks of church as a building, but as he analyzes the use of church, he starts to think that of it as more meaningful. The speaker thinks that church is a place where people go in order to become more wiser and to understand the deeper meaning of life.
ReplyDelete3) I believe it's important to the speaker to try to tell the truth, to be accurate, about his experience. I agree with Tessa that the speaker feels confused about the true religious meanings. The speaker first thinks about the disappearance of the church and thinks that religion is an unfounded belief. In the second half, the speaker realizes that people believe in god although they do not have faith, and he starts to question about how peoples' lives would be without religion. The line "was proper to grow wise in" shows the speaker's opinion about the truth of the church that it is the place where people go to become more wiser.
rachelraczyski
ReplyDelete3. Yes I do believe it is important for the reader to tell the truth. The reader is telling about the church. He tells that he goes to many churches. "I sign the book, donate an Irish sixpence, reflect the place was not worth stopping for." He told the truth that no other church goers would probably state. I think this man is confused about religion. "Which he once heard, was proper to grow wise in, if only so many dead lie round." I thought that this meant that he was questioning why we go to church. I think he is saying that so many people have died for religion and that it might not be worth it.
6. His attitude to churches is very negative. As we see through the poem he questions the church and how we use it. "Since someone will forever be surprising a hunger in himself to be more serious. I believe he is saying that church is holding people back and that you are not going to get anything for going to church. Instead, people can discover themselves without devoting themselves to church.
6. I agree with Dian that the poet takes a neggative approach towards the church,but I also think that he is just pointing out the obvious, church is a ritual. He asks the question what would it be like without religion. At the begining of the poem the poet ponders over the lack of interest in religion and how some beleive it to be a superstition.Then he questions what it would be like without religion, without a belief in God. What the world would be like without anything. He then goes on as iof he has made a discovery, that humans feel the need to believe in something bigger and better than ourselves.
ReplyDelete7. I think that the reason the poet says "here endeth" is a symbol that we are getting closer and closer to the end of christianity and that peoples beliefs are changing.